. yesterday's "new york times" had a 5,000-word story with a front page headline "crossing the line trump's private conduct with women." and the times e-mailed a news alert "donald trump has repeatedly unnerved women in private encounters over 40 years. here is the thing, "new york times," i'm not saying that donald trump objectifying women for 40 years isn't a story, it's been a story for 40 years. the special report? not that special. generally speaking the banner headline on the front page is

like reserved for a headline. >> good morning, tuesday may 17th. willie geist. joe and mika will be with us shortly. we have nicole wallace, msnbc contributor mike barnacle, and mike halperin. it was a honor to serve alongside mr. halperin. and you hear from professor after the university of michigan school of public policy harold ford jr. and in washington anchor for "world news america" -- >> except i'm in boston. like washington a little farther north. >> yeah. >> let's talk about why you were up there. joe and mika honored by a cable hall of fame in an induction ceremony that went late. tell uscady. >> it was great.

the show was honored. it was a fabulous tribute. i think that was mike was referred to as the cranky uncle of the "morning joe" family. >> sounds about right. >> it's kind of true, right. mark halperin gave a nice tribute to joe and mika. that was lovely. i think nicole was mentioned, too, and willie was the chirpy child that kept mom and dad from fighting. >> chirpy child? not what i was hoping for. >> you got mentioned. >> yeah. >> it was lovely. it was very nice, and a lot of people paid tribute to the show. you know, it was very good to recognize what this program has done and how different it is from everything that came before it on cable television and how joe and mika revolutionized the conversation and kept it partisan and got different points of view.

we know in the world we live in, politically it's great to have a place where we can talk about issues in the respectful way. even when we have differences of opinion. >> it is. nice of you to emcee the event. >> the plaque is on the wall. >> yeah. i wrote the text for the plaque. >> there you go. excellent. joe will be with us in a few minutes. the race between donald trump and hillary clinton narrowing, according to the nbc news survey monkey weekly poll. hillary clinton 48% to donald trump's 45. clinton maintains her advantage over trump with women voters a 15 point margin. down from 19 last week but big. trump's 11 point lead among men remains unchanged. clinton wins black voters 84-9, hispanic voters 65-28 and trump is up among white voters.

both candidates holding their own among party supporters. trump is doing better among independents. 44% to clinton's 36. trump called paul ryan the leader of the republican party, more republicans trust trump in this poll to lead the gop. 58% to 39%. nicole, what jumps at you? >> what jumps out when i say to my democratic friends, you don't know that trump can't win. and so for me, what it say is stunning is that bernie sanders is still in the race delivering humiliating loss after humili e humiliating loss to hillary clinton weakening her. if you study the psychology of a swing voter, when they hear a negative message from a partisan on one side and the same negative message about a politician on the extreme opposite side it starts to sink in. i think that should hillary

clinton get edged out by donald trump in november, what will be interesting to me is that this is what had happened. when bernie sanders stayed in the race, when he had no mathematical possibility of being the democratic nominee and beat the you know what out of her. donald trump picked up the attacks and went after her character and ethics and her energy. i think it will have been the period when the most damage was done to hillary clinton. >> mark? what do you think? >> you could say the same thing about donald trump now. right, the things coming out of nicole's former colleague mike gur ston's mouth, the conservative. and the same thing that the democrats are saying about him. >> mike gurstone isn't running for president. right. but mitt romney ran for president saying the same thing about donald trump. it's strange because in our partisan and polarized country, normally in our politics now one tribe says one thing and the other says the other.

both face criticism within their own party as the same from the other side. and i agree this is a critical period for both of them. and you see now with the super pa pacs. does trump need tv ads? he didn't when he was running for the nomination. now that the clinton side is going up with tv ads big time from now through election day. does trump need that backing or not? >> harrold, it's tight there, obviously. if you look in the numbers hillary has the leads among women and minority voters. they're going to decide the election. >> i don't disagree with what nicole said. i think mark balanced it out, but at this point, i think voters more and more are getting a look at the candidates and saying who can be president? if i were hillary clinton, and i'm for hillary clinton, i think the focus has to be on behaving like a president. at some point they're going to say who i do trust?

second, i knew it was going to get tight. i've shared with my democratic friends, didn't matter whom it was. this is what happens when you have a. republican nominee and democratic nominee. it will be a month longer. >> do know what happens to my inside? i went ah, a month longer. >> we're not going to have the grace period. where i agree with you i think it's trump it's more important. he has to reconcile some of the parts of his party. as much as sanders is a problem, at some point he has to consider getting out before july. the goal is not for him to continue to make the important points. the goal is to beat the republican. i would say to my democratic friends, particularly sanders supporters, when does your focus switch to that? when did you begin to switch to taking on republicans and taking on donald trump and ensuring

that mr. obama's legacy continues and we're able to grow wages and jobs. >> the minute he gets out, hillary clinton becomes a charter member of the dlc again. >> the key is -- i hear you. if the key is winning the presidency. >> i have a point of difference what is going on here at the table. point of difference is voters are thinking about who can be president. i think voters are looking at these candidates and saying are you kidding me? they're not think abouting who can be president. they're thinking this is the gift we've been given? and the numbers that willie rolled out today, the numbers we're talking about are a gift to the clinton campaign in the long run because if there's any complacency at all in that campaign about running against donald trump, it ought not to be there. he is a potentially lethal threat to her candidacy today and will be in the last week in october. and they better get going about

who she really is and she better start showing us who she really is. >> all right. >> i wasn't saying that -- i hear what you're saying. we have two choices. so people are looking at -- i agree with you in that regard pop there may be some truth there. >> let's look closer at donald trump's campaign. after touting the financial benefits of relying on public polling, donald trump's campaign hired a pollster. the chief pollster for bob dole's 1996 campaign and recently worked for rand paul's presidential bid and rick scott. in 2011 politico reported he passed up on the chance for working for trump's perspective bid. he ended up on the rick perry. he added this to chuck todd in augus

august. >> so this is one of many small steps, most of them small steps, and the professionalizations of donald trump's campaign. the acknowledgment he has to do things a little differently in the general election than he was able to do in the primary. >> it's that tension, right, that donald trump faces now between being himself, as he says being authentic. being somebody who is a bit of a maverick and offend people sometimes and running a much more conventional campaign. both to reach out to people who are in the center of american politics, but also because you need the structure of a conventional campaign. how he juggles the limitations of trying to be a more normal

candidate while keeping that quality of his, the people have flocked to during the primary campaign, i think that's biggest challenge. can he do it? can he work within the confines of a normal presidential campaign with the pollsters, the strategists, television, and raising money for super pacs and being donald trump, the guy who says things as they are. he's given conflicting messages on this. he said in some interviews saying i'm not going to inspire voters in ohio if i become normal and traditional and he hires pollsters and seems to recognize he has to change some things. >> from the traditional wing of the campaign apparatus here. there's no one more poll obsessed than donald trump. if you watch the live feed of his speeches, i was transfixed, he spends the first 20 minutes and this poll says and bernie sanders picked it up as a tick. i don't have any explanation for

it. there's no one more poll obsessed on the race on either side than donald trump. all he's doing is hired his own pollster. the notion he hasn't been driven by the polls, and i think the affirmation for the nonnormal things he's done has been the response in the polls. >> but those are horse race polls he's citing rather than public opinion in terms of issues or crafting a message based on polling. >> i don't think he'll pollster to craft messages. he'll use it to determine to where he should travel. i think the notion is some vast departure from the way things have been done is ludicrous. no one spent more time talking about that are poll numbers than donald trump. >> what i think he'll do if you talk about the economy in the way that voters find more appealing. >> to the degree he can be disciplined about any method. sure. he'll start talking about the economy in a way that voters respond to. he does from a gut level. i don't think a -- >> he does it well from a kbgut level. where i think she's most

vulnerable is on the economy. i think he'll bring on stage with him a little card with poll-tested language. not changing his message. he's underperformed as a candidate talking about the economy, trade, and immigration. and tony's record suggests he'll help trump. >> this is a guy he'll listen to? who is tony fa brees zoe? >> he had associations with donald trump and worked with the dole campaign. he's among the best pollsters in the republican party. and he's not strongly ideological guy. he's about winning and messaging. he's gotten a lot of people elected focussing, again, on economic issues particularly contrasts. if the republican party has a string on domestic policy, it's on democrat on economics. >> are they anywhere sophisticated as the silicon valley stuff that started with the obama campaign in 2012? the microtargeting? does the trump campaign have that capacity? >> not yet. it's not clear they will.

trump played it down. i think clearly trump has a better chance of winning for he's gotten some infrastructure. he's got a super pac and fundraising and polling and sophistication. but his skills pay for some of that. he doesn't need as much a normal candidate. >> if he goes out there with a card and poll tested economic language and has in his head the latest hit on hillary clinton there's no way he's going to pass over the little card. >> now he can do both. >> he has twitter, too. he can do all three. i think that the most interesting development is not the pollster. it's how fully frontal they're being about how low they're going to go in attacking hillary clinton. >> today -- >> you brought me to the next story. we're learning from the trump campaign that trump plans to raise bill clinton's infidelities in debates against hillary clinton. telling the new york tooichls it will be a broad attack on his character.

getting nasty with hillary won't work. you have to get people to look hard at her character. what do you think of this as a strategy? first of all, a candidate is announcing the thing he's going stay on the stage in a debate in five months. >> so you can contrast that with the "new york times" raising questions about mr. trump's past. he countered saying that the person who was a subject of the protagonist in the story was not suggesting anything negative. unfortunately it looks as if it's going to become a race about personalities and not vision. and i think at some point the voters -- i think, voters will reject this path. largely whatever you want to say about bill clinton and his personal life and private life. if it didn't wreck his political life why should his personality

choices wreck his wife's political career. having said that, it's going to be entertaining at the least and could be a disaster in terms of the politics. i hope we explore how he's taken on david cameron openly. i think it was a weird thing to do. to say i'm going to remember what he said. i've never remembered a president saying you better know i'm going to remember this if i'm elected president. our greatest ally. it's a strange set of circumstanc circumstances. nicer putin, no doubt about it. but how to you say that to one of our greatest friend and ally? >> i can't stop laughing. let's go to barnacle. >> katty, what do you think about that? >> well, you know, cameron is not backing down from it. he's got no reason to do so. donald trump has now come out in favor of britain leaving the european union which puts him on a different side of the page from david cameron politically

on that critical issue at the moment. why on earth would david cameron say, by the way, i like donald trump? you know, donald trump is a bit of a gift at at the moment to politicians in london. he's a gift to the london mayor. he's a bit of a gift to david cameron, too. there are a few people in the u.k. at the moment who have as high unfavorability ratings as donald trump. >> does it hurt him to do this? >> i can't figure out how that plays. i think people who think that traditional foreign policy views are going to matter. you know, you talked about before about who is qualified to be president. for a lot of americans, they want a president someone who will change washington. that's the biggest quality they want. a guy that sends signals he's going to stand up to traditional american allies i think that's a signifier to change to some people. >> let's listen to what donald trump said about prime minister cameron. >> david cameron recently said

he stands by his comments that your position on muslims was stupid, divisive, and wrong. >> yeah. >> he wouldn't apologize. >> honestly, i don't care. it doesn't matter. it's fine. >> if you're.and he's the british prime minister. >> looks like we won't have a good relationship. who knows. it sounds like he's not willing to address the problem either. >> you like david cameron to withdraw the particular comments that you're stupid, divisive, and wrong. >> number one i'm not stupid. i can tell you that now. and just the opposite. number two, in terms of divisive. i don't think i'm a divisive person. i'm a unifier unlike our president now. >> if you listen to that, he would say i'm responding to something an cameron. i'm not coming out of nowhere with the comments. >> i think the interesting thing what mark said how does it play as we move into the general election stage?

it's one thing to say we want somebody who will do foreign policy differently. it's another to take on directly a country for which a lot of americans still have enormous amount of affection and would see as a country you would want to keep on board. if you're going to alienate a country around the world, britain, really, for the u.s., it just seems why pick that fight? why not try and build a better relationship? i think a lot of people will think, you know, who next? is this somebody who is reliable in terms of foreign policy? and i still think, as we head into this stage, hillary's safety and perhaps over caution could actually start playing better precisely because donald trump looks too much of a somebody who is, you know, you can't quite rely on when it comes to issues of foreign policy. >> katty, what would be your instinct on how donald trump's position on immigration, on the muslim ban would play out in

great britain among people? >> as david cameron has said, i think the muslim ban was widely derided among brits and even his position on immigration has been fairly criticized, even though we have issues with immigration ourselves. you're not hearing people in britain talk the donald trump-type language when it comes to immigrants. still ahead on "morning joe" part lightning rod and lightning in a bottle. what does the clinton have in mind if the clintons make it back to the white house? chuck todd and tom brokhaw join us. and kristen soltis anderson is set to meet with facebook tomorrow. first, bill kairns with a look at the forecast. >> more bad news for our friends in the mid atlantic. we've had a horrible may. you had a nasty stretch of weather this upcoming weekend. let me show you the bad stuff

yesterday. north texas, handle of oklahoma. they call it an elephant trunk tornado. as it began to weaken it came into a rope tornado. it's the ending stage of that twister. let's take you to areas where we saw strong gusty winds. this roof awning looked like it was going to go but it did hold up. pretty good gust there lifted it 40 to 50 there's also hail with that. this morning more storms in texas. good news for dallas and fort worth. the storms weakened but it will shortly throughout your early morning chute. later today more storms develop in texas. 16 million people at risk from del rio to san antonio to houston. for the east this is just a messy scenario. a lot of clouds and rain now from kentucky through west virginia. shortly arriving in washington, d.c. definitely umbrella day from charlotte to raleigh, d.c., baltimore, and philadelphia. by the time we get to saturday heavy rain is possible in areas of the east. unfortunately it looks like saturday may be a potential wash

out from mid atlantic region. a lot of graduation plans and outdoor activities this time of year. it's not what you want to hear. leave you with a shot of new york city on the northern edge of clouds. should remain pretty dry, new york city. temperatures still on the cool side. more "morning joe" when we come back. you totaled your brand new car.

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let's suppose here is the question. what is your plan to create jobs? his answer is i'm going create em. they're going to be great. i know how to do it. but i'm not telling you what it is i'm going to do. >> hillary clinton holding three events in kentucky yesterday while she went after bernie sanders' record on the auto bail out. she had steady stream of attacks for donald trump. kentucky and oregon have their primaries today with 134 delegates at stake combined. clinton needs 140 more dell gets to reach the number needed for nomination. there's speculation as to what bill clinton's role would be in a hillary clinton white house after comments like these on the campaign trail. >> my husband, who i'm going to

put in charge of revitalizing the economy, because, you know, he knows how to do it, and especially in places like coal country and inner-cities and other parts of our country that have been left out. >> the clinton campaign said there are no formalized plans as for the former president as of now. aids say i had could focus on hard-hit areas of the country like the rust belt. economic advisor to barack obama told the times, quote, there's a practical puzzle of how his role would jive with the existing cabinet members whose job it is to work on the economy. legally a family member of a president cannot hold a cabinet-level position and the clinton campaign said comments like the ones you heard a moment ago from secretary clinton are in line with what the candidate has been saying all along about how the former president's expertise will be put use. as for bill clinton himself. here is what he said last night.

>> hillary is an impossible box. you know, you can't imagine bill over there in the east wing in the spouses' quarters licking stamps and addressing enhave a lo -- envelopes. it's hilary's job if she wants to be president. it's not the first spouse's job. >> as newt grinch said bill clinton will be not begarden. >> to put in context, his eight years and 23 million jobs created saw fewer people -- more kids going to college, graduating from college, wages going up. i think these things that our economy growing from the standpoint that exports were growing across the world. i think she probably is saying

in that context. there's no doubt they'll comply with the legal. but i don't think it's anything wrong. i think it's something that voters across the spectrum would like a president with that kind of record helping to advise. the point has to be taken seriously you have to figure out how it fits. >> why not make him the vice president? >> i'm not sure constitutionally you can do that. i don't think she's going to do that. i'm not -- >> how can the election get any weirder? >> it can and it will. >> that i agree with. >> i think trump should pick bernie and hillary pick bill. >> there's no doubt the former president would be a huge asset to any administration. at some point hillary clinton has to tell the country where she wants to take the country. >> and she said she's not running for his third term. >> yeah.

>> obama or her -- >> both. both. look, he's popular with a lot of people. he's more popular than any two of the candidates. but mike just said, she has too win it on her own. and more and more no one in politics dealt with bill clinton and hugged him close and not have drama associated with bill clinton. it comes with him. i think she needs less drama. >> she seems to do these things in her moments of weakness. when she's down and delivers a strong debate performance. she hugs obama and the obama legacy and when she's done she's lost eight of the last nine primaries. she makes up some, you know, possibly unconstitutional role for her husband. in her moments of weakness she leans on obama and her husband. it doesn't project the strength her supporters would like to see when she's down. >> the key quote from yesterday's piece in the washington post gets to it when

a long time friend of both clintons says, i'm paraphrasing here. she's terrible at campaigning but will be great at governing. >> that's what they said about jeb bush. >>well, what is he doing today? >> he would have been a great president but so you to survive the campaign. >> yeah. coming up remember this from the 1992 presidential election? the "new york times" took that moment and ran with it. we'll talk to one author who said the paper's weekend piece on donald trump and women is in a similar tradition to that screaming a-1 headline aboi hea bush xli that turned out to be not so much. we'll talk ahead.

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♪ you'll just have to miss it! ♪ yeah, you'll just have to miss it! ♪ ♪ we can't let you download... uh, no thanks. i have x1 from xfinity so... don't fall for directv. xfinity lets you download your shows from anywhere. i used to like that song. let's get in sports. harold stayed up late to watch the game. the nba highest scoring regular season teams sca s squaring off game one of a highly anticipated western game final. league mvp steph curry. this is pregame warm ups make every shot he took from the half-court logo. five for five. that's a warm up for steph. the game now. the warriors get out to a great start. curry adding another the record his résume.

breaking reggie miller's three pointers in consecutive. second half oklahoma city gets going corralling back from a big deficit as many as 14 points in the big beginning of the third quarter. ru russell west brooke. 108-102 on the road against golden state. >> i turned off at halftime. >> it looked like golden state was going to run away. second half westbrooke and durant. they don't stop. they are energizer batteries nonstop up-and-down the court. if you're golden state, the defense has to pick up a little bit. the speed and agility of these guys can be hard to contain. and young phil griffin's son picked them to win it. >> win it on the road. >> let's get to baseball. the twins were trailing the tigers 8-0 after the first inning. by the fourth tempers flair over

detroit manager brad ausmus ejected. he marched over to kick a little dirt on home plate and takes off his shirt and puts it over the plate. >> dart mouth guy. >> detroit actually blew the lead. >> is that like an offering? what is that move about? >> covering up home plate so you don't see the plate. >> the frustration of a losing team. he's probably going get fired. he's a great guy but -- >> the wheels come off. >> this cleveland a base hit in the bottom of the inning gives cleave la cleveland a run. close call at the plate. check out the replay here. davis beats the tag. took it out again here. untouched as he slides the back foot across home plate to score safely. call overturned. not that the indians needed run.

are we doing every game? look at this. i'm not complaining. a's outfielder billy burns a full extension and diving catch. and top of the sixth a's win 3-1. there's more, finally, it app r appears come back tour for tiger woods on pro. he voiced uncertainty at a competitive play at a press conference yesterday and set out to prove viability of practice swing on a short hole at congressional country club. all ended up in the drink. >> splash. >> his last one cleared the hazard but landed on a steep bank and rolled back in. >> i hope he makes a come back. >> i do, too. >> i do, too. coming up robert costa with the rest of the baseball highlights of the morning. and on the heels of donald trump.

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get an insurance quote and see why 92% of our members plan to stay for life. joining us now pulitzer prize editorial writer for the washington post jonathan ca capeheart and the political reporter if the washington post and msnbc political reporter robert costa. >> so, bob, you talked to trump yesterday. what was the headline on your conversation to you? >> the headline this is a candidate who is adjusting to the general election and wants to fix his image. someone who knows he has some problems when it comes to women voters, when it comes to other groups and he has self-awareness. that was my take away.

>> snrl. >> yeah. he doesn't want to change too much. i feel like trump wants to explain himself to the country. who knows how he's going to do that. bring on the pollster is a big move for donald trump. >> self-awareness is one thing. flipping the female vote, and flipping the african-american vote, flipping the latino vote in five 1/2 months is a bigger challenge. >> it is a big challenge. plus, in the political age we're in, nothing dies. everything lives. so every nasty comment, every nasty jab, every nasty joke. every horrible thing he has said in the campaign will come back to haunt him and people have to reckon with themselves whether they really believe that the person they have seen over the last year can change so quickly and be different if he's elected president. >> can i ask you, i feel like his opportunity with women voters isn't about speaking some woman code. all though if anyone can do it it sounds like trump thinks he could. i feel it's showing up the national security credentials.

he met with james baker an has a meeting with kissen ger. >> he's meeting with him on wednesday. he's not meeting with traditional hawks and people who dominated the republican party for the last few decades. he's going back to the realist school. the richard nixon, henry kissen jer voice of the republican party. i was struck on what he said on transgender rights. he's not a striding social warrior. he doesn't transgender issues in the same way a social conservative in the south has who is a rising politician. he used the quote to us, we need to protect everybody. he said i want to have a more human we of dealing with everyone. he didn't have much relationship or experience with people who had transgender issues but he wants to learn more. he's studying the issue closely. >> that seems like the opportunity with women. women are sensitive to how people talk about socially conservative issues and even if they're not on one side or the other, they care about

tolerance. i think those are the windows into women. >> we covered earlier that he also is going to attack hillary in a front, direct, and personal way. did you get a sense how he plans to reconcile that style of attack of wanting to present himself in this self-awareness issue that you spoke of? >> my colleagues and i started out the interview talking about the democratic advertising that is coming from the democratic super pacs. his response to that was he's going to continue do interview after interview have media appearances be his campaign. he's going to be relentless in attacking the clinton family and legacy. it's going to be a personal hyper combative campaign. >> do you think there's a risk of that bill clinton and attaching hillary clinton to those things. for some people who say whether it is true or not she's the victim. what do bill clinton's indiscretions have to do with her and her ability to be president? >> yes. as we saw in the '90s when

hillary clinton is the victim, you know, in that case, she was. her husband globally humiliated her. her poll numbers went up. the sympathy factor was way high with her, which is understandable. i think now she's running for president of the united states, on her own, for her own term, people will look and say what does his indiscretion, what do the indiscretions have to do with her? and yes, they're still married. you can make a case that despite that stuff that happened they're still married. >> women cleave out the two things. i think what he did, cheating on your wife is the area for which they felt sympathy for her. participating in the humiliation of monica lewinsky has been celebrated by donald trump as the object for scrutiny. donald trump isn't criticizing hillary clinton for having affairs. donald trump is criticizing hillary clinton for the narrow role she played in victimizing

the mistress. that is -- and in the minds of women who have been in this position, they are two very separate issues. >> right. you know, this is going to be a glass house battle here. we're not talking about impurity versus -- >> i don't think trump lives in a glass house. >> in a tower. >> he's going to stick to that crooked tag. he keeps using with secretary clinton. he keeps coming back to the theme in our conversation and elsewhere that he thinks the clintons are corrupt. that's why he's reviving the '90s issues. >> and, you know, to that point, and to your point, i think, in an earlier segment about bernie sanders and there's a story, i think, in the times within the last hour about how donald trump once again is using bernie sanders' arguments against hillary clinton. the longer bernie sanders is in the race, the more he's giving material to donald trump to beat hillary clinton. >> let's squeeze in a must-read

op-ed from michael gurston. conservatives make a deal with the devil. it has been kind of remarkable how quickly the people who despise and couldn't symptomatic the idea of donald trump running are starting to fall in line. >> there are hold outs who will hold out on the grounds of the recklessness of the choice of

donald trump. there are simply not enough of them. they are completely out of step with the base of the republican party. >> and trump's destroying the conventional wisdom that can conservatives can have litmus tests for candidates and determine who wins the nomination or not based on your ideology. he's walked around the whole system that has been put in place for the last few years. but on gurston's argument where is the third party conservative candidate? they're talking about trump is not conservative enough. no one is willing to step up and run as an independent. >> is it still a pipe dream? >> it's a pipe dream. the clock is ticking. the ballot deadlines will start expiring next month. >> bob costa, thank you very much. jonathan, stay with us. coming up education, jobs, and justice in black america. a sweeping new report due out today that promises to play a key role in the run up to november. national urban league president marc memorial is here with the 40th edition of the group's finding. back with more "morning joe."

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today the national transportation safety board is expected to hold a hearing and vote on the probably cause of the amtrak derailment that left eight people dead near philadelphia last year. a source close to the investigation tells nbc news the train's engineer brandon boss was likely distracted by radio dispatches at the time of the derailment. he told investigators he could barely remember the moments

leading up to the incident he had a dream-like memory of the locomotive going around a curve. an engineer on the separate train reported his wheelchainds had been hit by something. coming up the top of the hour -- >> i don't think i'm that bad. >> you're like -- >> thank you. >> i appreciate it. >> the washington post chris is a little za said that's famous exchange of what could be a saving grace against donald trump. a likability problem is better than a likability epidemic. how one of his arms inspired marco rubio's tweet storm. a lot to get through with the fix when we come back. soon.

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hillary clinton is currently beating bernie sanders in every measurable category except how many people woo when you say their name. check it out. bernie sanders -- [ cheers and applause ] hillary clinton -- [ cheers and applause ] all right not as big but add in the super delegates. [ cheers and applause ] perfectly legal. hey. it's perfectly legal. check the rules. >> welcome back to "morning joe." it's tuesday, may 17th. joe with us now from boston. joe, we've been celebrating with you all morning. congratulations. >> i know, willie. >> the cable hall of fame. >> it's unbelievable. >> how was the speech?

did the bust come out the way you hoped it would? >> it did. it really did. i refer you back to, you know, lou gehrig's farewell. it was a bit like that. exactly. i had to do that. it was all very moving. but some exciting news today. i say exciting because for us, at least, this race that was supposed to be a blow out, willie, it looks like we're going to have hand to hand conflict for the next six months. >> yeah. we have pretty remarkable nbc polls. i want to introduce everybody on the set. nicolle wallace. mike barnacle, i think is somewhere. he says he's here but i don't see him anywhere. nope. false advertising. msnbc contributor jonathan capeheart. next to him is the great harrold ford. you know harrold. former mccain senior campaign

strategies steve schmidt. and editor of "the fix" of the washington post chris is a el a eliza, and katty kay. we're sorry mike barnacle went missing. >> we need a search and rescue mission. >> you never know. he might have shuffled away. the race between donald trump and hillary clinton is narrowing. nbc surveymonkey shows hillary clinton at 48% and donald trump at 45%. secretary clinton maintains her advantage over trump with women voters. a 15-point margin down a bit from 19 last week. donald trump's 11-point lead among men remains unchange. clinton's strength with minority

winning black voters 84 to 9. trump is up among 14 points among white voters. both candidates holding their own among party supporters trump is doing better among independents. 44% to clinton's 36. and last week trump called house speaker paul ryan the leader of the republican party. more republicans actually trust trump than ryan to lead the party. that's by a 58-39% margin. that's a lot to get through, joe. >> a couple of the things are jumping out. this is not paul ryan's party anymore. it's donald trump's party. it has nothing to do with donald trump. it has a lot to do with where the republican party has gone over the past 20 or 30 years. working class voters feel disconnected from washington, d.c. especially washington, d.c., republicans who they feel like they let them down. let them down. not only when they ran the deficit and the debt up during the bush years, but also they elected the tea partiers in 2010

to get rid of obamacare and do other great things that didn't happen. 2014, the same thing happened. so that's the first thing. this is not paul ryan's party. paul ryan's policies are not the policies that drive the republican base anymore. they are more of a populist base of policies. also, the hispanic vote. donald trump, it would seem, has gone out of his way to offend hispanics. at least in this poll. he seems to be doing as well or better than mitt romney did by the end. i don't know if that's celebrity. i'm not sure what that is. but there is room for growth in that hispanic vote that we've been saying will stop donald trump from being president. and then there are many other things to look at. but, nicole, one number i'm looking at now is the consolidation not just among the republican party establishment in d.c. who caved into donald trump over the past week, but also across the nation.

republicans are behind their nominee. their presumptive nominee. 87%. that 87% of republicans -- remember, that number when donald trump started last year was 1%. 1%. he's got 87% of the republican party behind him right now. and, nicole, that's keeping the race close. how has this happened? >> i think you hit the nail on the head. i think the party no longer stands for that which the establishment has promoted and the policy machinery that paul ryan has been a part of. and what paul ryan actually believes is in free and fair trade. he believes in fundamental entitlement reform. he believes in a more robust foreign policy of his running mate mitt romney. and that set of believes i don't know the base of the party will be attracted to that idea set again. so this is all about trump.

we keep talking about the shiny object, but i think the real story is the base of our party no longer believes in the set of policies that george w. bush ran on and won twice, that john mccain ran on and lost and mitt romney ran on and lost. i think we ignored the canaries in the mine. voters said they like trump and agree with him on policy questions. >> yes, steve schmidt, there's always been the divide. i've talked about it from the moment i walked into congress. there were k street republicans, the guys that went out and golfed with all the lobbyists day in and day out and usually they were in leadership because they had the money. they were the guys pushing for the mexican bail out. they were pushing nafta, the wto, pushing for intervention in bosn bosnia. pushing for intervention in koso kosovo. we fought them every step of the way on the issues and yet we figured out a way to synthesize the two sides. for the most part, 95% of the

time, it seemed like we got -- we were able to come together. but over the past 20 to 25 years, there has been a deep denial of the strong populist strain that sent people like me to washington, d.c., in '94, 2010, and 2014. it's exploded in 2016, hasn't it? >> look, the republican party, joe, has become increasingly reliant on high school-educated, white men that we haven't had policies to address the collapse of the american middle class. the effects of globalization, the offshoring of the formerly middle class jobs that gave a middle class lifestyle to the american men and women that made things with their hands. that worked on the assembly line. when we look back at the beginning of the campaign, we saw the trump number, the carson number, the ted cruz number, we saw 40 plus percent of the party is in open rebellion against the

washington establishment. that number has only grown and the washington political class of the republican party has been thoroughly repudiated in this election. donald trump has stormed the castle walls. he has deposed the kings and the dukes and the leaders of the republican party, and when you look at those numbers, he's consolidated republican voters behind him. the party is behind donald trump. >> chris, let's look at your latest piece. you talk about the likability of hillary clinton and donald trump. or lack thereof.

chris? >> yeah. i mean, you look at hillary clinton in a take down trump out of it for a minute, willie. look at her numbers, she's under water, she is higher unfavorable than favorable. two-thirds of the country doesn't believe she's honest and trust worthy. you know, she has problems across a wide spectrum of issues you would look at and say this is someone who is not particularly strong as they can be. the fact that a 74-year-old democratic socialist from vermont continues to win races, continues to win states will likely win oregon today tells you something about the resi resistance to hillary clinton. even within the democratic party. it's a binary election. so if you don't want a you get

b. b. is donald trump in this case. for a lot of voters who would look elsewhere, honestly, who would look to someone other than hillary clinton, who would like someone other than hillary clinton who want to connect with someone other than hillary clinton. his numbers, at least, suggest he's less popular than she is. she's less trusted on issues. people think that he shares less of their values than she does. and that's the problem. you don't beat something with nothing and right now trump, at least in terms of polling on value questions is close to nothing. >> harrold ford, this is a question of hillary clinton being more likable. i've said it. i know you've said it. it for those of us who had the opportunity to talk to miss clinton and spend some time with her. and, you know, i said this the first time i met her in 1995. when i run against her in

hillary care and everything else and got elected because of it. so, you know, you've heard reagan be reagan. hillary is the likable hillary when she's not running in political campaigns. she tightens up once she starts running in political campaigns. how does hillary become more of the hillary that you know when she's not the middle of the political campaign. this is a tough one. how does she become more like herself in private? >> the lead into this segment, joe, was a exchange between mrs. clinton and then senator obama. i think senator obama made a point you're likable enough and she reacted in a natural way. there are times we have shown clips on this show. i think she was in new hampshire or iowa. there was a young girl who offered a emotional set of remarks to her and she walked over and hecked the young lady. and i think we respond houd human and real it was. they've got to put her in

environments and, frankly, where the natural hillary comes out. she's got to be herself around issues. she can't try to be something that she's not. she's a policy walk. one of the reasons she's been awarded politically throughout her career when she's put in settings where she dealt with serious issues. the moment she tries to step down or try to find ways to take on donald trump and the way trump takes her on is when she's not good. i hope they keep her in natural settings. put her in set wrgs her natural side comes out. the more she does that, she'll be the person that we know one on one and her donors know. >> the trump campaign will try to keep her off balance. trump plans to raise bill clinton's infidelities against hillary clinton. his strategy will be a broad attack on clinton's character.

meanwhile clinton allies already on the attack priority usa the pro clinton super pac spent $75 million on president obama's re-election in 2012 is hitting trump in swing states spending in excess of $6 million on new ads that began airing this morning in ohio, virginia, florida, and nevada and will continue for the next four weeks. >> there was blood coming out of her eyes. blood coming out of her whenever. does she have a good body? no. a fat as, yes. >> if ivanka weren't my daughter, perhaps i would be dating her. >> you can tell them to go [ expletive ] themselves. >> does donald trump really

speak for you? >> crest this is a piece with the front page "new york times" one of the women and the main actors come out to refute. how does he handle this? how big a problem is this for him? >> he's clearly flustered. he's been tweeting up a storm about the story. women are where a lot of the swing votes are. i think the real question is are there any women in america who at this point don't really know what donald trump's record looks like on these things? what i think priorities u.s. a and the democrats are banking on there are a lot of voters who haven't need it yet. maybe they heard that donald trump said offensive thing but haven't heard the content. they can push the unfavorables even lower. what will make the election volatile is somebody is going to walk into a voting booth and pick somebody they don't like. so it may be that even if they don't love donald trump and they know he said offensive things

they still like him on policy. they still think he would fix the economy. they trust him on an issue they care about more. while it's attempt to push down the unfavorables this may be an election where the most unfavorable person is still able to win. >> katty with a lot of times you look at the numbers and they're unbelievable. donald trump at 37% approval and 62% disapproval. hillary at 40% approval and 59% disapproval. it's a complete race to the bottom. we've never seen anything like this. if you're going to make those numbers stick, you usually think that the summer or late fall would make sense. i remember john hileman writing in may saying that obama people were going to spend the spring painting mitt romney as a whaertless capitalist that threw people out of work and killed them. what they did in may actually stuck with mitt romney all the way through election night.

so i guess this might be part of the clinton plan right now as well. >> and especially when you have bernie sanders raising these attacks as well. this is damaging to the clinton campaign about sanders staying in the race. he's going after hillary clinton in a way that is givinged toer to donald trump. you see donald trump picking up on bernie sabders attacks. if we look back in november, if this turns out to be a tight election or donald trump is ahead in polls we'll remember these few weeks where bernie sanders refused to get out of the race and donald trump could use that to his advantage. he's being attacked not just by her republican opponents, but she's being attacked by democrat as well. how damaging is that to her reputation to those likability numbers and particularly to the issue of trust worthiness. >> jonathan, i want to say on the likability numbers for a second. you know, the rule usually is if

you're an incumbent and well known and your numbers are below 50%, then you're beatble. donald trump at 37%. hillary clinton at 40%. bernie sanders, of course, way up at 56%. that's pretty incredible in this election year. but you look at those bottom two numbers and say do they get elected president of the united states? >> well, you're going have one against the other. no matter what, one of them is going to be elected. and the fact that they're both seen as unfavorable or have unfavorable opinions that cancels it out and maybe we get to talk about real issues and not focus on personality. it's a bit of a pipe dream there. but, you know, those poll numbers that you showed at the beginning of the segment fascinate me because one thing there are several points here but i want to point out one

thing to viewers. threw it out here on the table and the fact is everyone focussed on working class voters and whether they're going to turn to trump and keep leaving out sort of the demographics of the race that we're looking at. and who donald trump and clinton are running to replace. barack obama. you have a huge african-american electorate out there that voted in numbers not seen in history in 2008 and 2012. you have a huge latino population out there that is going to go out and vote. the one key thing i keep coming back to is president obama won re-election in 2012 with 5 million fewer white votes. no democrat has won the presidency winning a majority of the white votes since johnson in 1964. as we go through this campaign cycle, and we look at those number ofs we saw there, i have to keep in mind that the white vote is important and working

class voters are important. but just as important in this race will be african-american and latino voters. especially when you have 50,000 latinos turning voting age every month for the next few decades. >> when you look at those numbers, if you're in the trump campaign, you center to be encouraged you're not at 3% with hispanic voters. you're at 28%. you're one point higher than mitt romney was. if you laook at the african-american numbers, he's higher than mitt romney was against the president. so the obama coalition can hillary clinton sustain that in a general election? i think, and if you look particularly at the african-american vote, i don't think it's inconceivable that donald trump can go north of 10% be it 11 or 12%. that fundamentally undermines the coalition. if you're donald trump now you have to be encouraged. for sure if you were looking at this through the prism of candidate a., candidate b.

you would say they're both unelectable people. the way one unelectable person gets elected is run against another unelectable person. one of the two is going to be the next president of the united states. >> the unelectables. inspiring. >> chris, one of your arts got marco rubio fired up on twitter last night. senator rubio responding to a piece about him not wanting to be vice president. rubio tweeted --

rubio continued with the mockery. a source said he was tired after a long day and decided to sleep for a few hours before tomorrow's zika debate in the senate. a long time friend said rubio is, quote, betwixted and between when it comes to whether to do chest or legs at the gym. and according to a source who knows his cousin's wife dentist said he could do cardio. >> i always do chest and legs. you got to keep yourself -- you've got to be even. you don't want to be big up top and little legs. here is the thing, here is the thing, willie. i didn't say he wasn't going to retire. in the piece it says people have tried to get him to stay in the senate because the florida filing deadline hasn't passed. but nothing in his tweet, which i was flattered by, gets to the point which is he doesn't know

what he's going to do next. people trying to get him to run for governor in 2018. i don't think he's going to do that. joe knows this, marco rubio is not certain what he does next. he has a bridge between now and the next time he can run for president and stay relatively high profile within the party. >> if you read the tweets, i think his complain you spoke to people, quote, close to him who were definitely not close to him. >> sure. that's totally fine. that's his right. i can't fight with that, but i would say my point is in what the folks told me is not disputed in any meaningful way by what he said. no one i talked to said marco is going to run again for the senate. no one said that. i was saying this is a guy with a bright future. this is a guy who is in his mid 40s but has to figure out something between now and 2020 or now and 2024 to stay in the political mix. and what does that look like? honestly, i'm certain that's

something he's thinking about. also, whether to do chest or legs. >> you used the word "betwixted" you should apologize. >> i love that word. you talked about loving betwixted. that's a flip-flop on your part. facebook ceo mark zuckerberg sitting down with several influential conservatives including glen beck, donald trump advisor barry bennett. tomorrow at the company's silicon valley headquarters. the meeting comes nine days after the tech blog reported allegations that editors of the sites trending topic section routinely filter out comment from news sites. facebook denied the claim saying it found no evidence to support it. kristen, what do you want to hearzuckerberg? >> how they think through the role of human cure ration in a data-driven world. we have trending topics that are supposed to tell us that is

trending and popular among the world and the friend groups. what the report said there are people who are the final line of defense who look at the stuff that data says is trending and really you're making decisions based on sort of their own preferences and what they think should count as news. and in this case, most of the folks doing those jobs it's reported are, you know, probably young kids who just graduated from really good colleges. maybe they don't think they have intentional biases. but maybe choosing stories that are of more personal interest to them and leaving conservative stories out. what i want to hear from mark zuckerberg and the facebook team is what do they think is the appropriate role of human judgment in this process of telling people what other stories they should be reading. it sounds like a traditional news room. that's fundamentally different than a data-driven algorithm which is a lot of people rely on facebook to do. >> it's an important meeting. joe, what do you think? >> i think whether it's facebook or whether it's google you have the most powerful companies in

the world that make their a anesthesiology r anesthesiololgorithms state sec. when you try to talk to them and get input in to how they determine where things are, whether it's on facebook or on google, they said that's a secret. that's a trade secret. again, the more powerful they become the more of a responsibility they have to explain publicly what they do privately. so there's transparency. so conservatives and liberals, bernie supporters, hillary supporters, trump supporters make sure they get a fair shake and not unpounded fairly by people who control the algorithms and keep it secret. >> kristen will extract the secrets. thank you so much. we'll see you soon.

>> chris isschris, thank you. >> my it's my son's birthday. harrold, we'll see you, man. still ahead chuck todd and tom brokhaw join us. and 40 years later take a look at how far black america has come and how far it has to go when marc morial joins us. we've heard about donald trump's personality but what about has psychology? >> i'm tired already. >> you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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it's a close game. a lot at stake. 50,000 represented by the charity. political terms is the category.

chuck, we come to you, first. this one caused you some concern. >> i didn't have it. >> didn't have it? >> nope. >> did you write anything down? okay. you lose everything. you drop to zero. >> that's our man chuck todd on last night's episode of jeopardy. the correct answer was "veto." he had a great show. i can never get any of those answers on the spot. i would have total brain freeze. >> one thing he gets wrong. joining us now tom brokhaw, attorney and republican strategies ben begginsburg and t of meet the press chuck todd. you had a great show. you were cranking out the answers. rand fire. >> you were at $12,500. you got a lot right. >> i expected no less.

>> what is the upside downside calculation of going on celebrity jeopardy? >> i think it's all downside. my wife was like what are you doing? you did that once and won. why did you ever -- drop the mike. never do it again. never again. >> yeah. >> no. it's fun to do. it really is. >> so, chuck, let's talk about the latest numbers that have come out from nbc news surveymonkey poll it shocks a lot of people. i'm surprised last week when it tightened up to a five-point race. now a three-point race. 87 percent of republicans actually have gone to donald trump's side. 28% of hispanics now supporting donald trump. that's a low number but it happens to be one percentage higher than mitt romney. what happening in these polls? >> i think the 87% is the more important figure. republican voters have come around to donald trump a lot faster than republican leaders. and we've seen the voters have

been ahead of the party elites, frankly, this entire primary campaign. that's what i feel like we're seeing, you know, let's see what happens when if he can, you know, if he standards making progress beyond that. one of the reasons why this is quickly gotten to what i call normal numbers what we would expect if it were generic is republicans have come home. they have come home. >> but, tom brokhaw, you look at the disapproval. it's stunning. i'm sure you've never seen numbers like this before. donald trump's disapproval ratings 62%. hillary's 59%. trump's approval rating only 37%. hillary's only 40%. those numbers are staggering. i would guess since you started covering national politics in the mid '60s you've never seen anything like this before. >> no, we have to remember where

we are as well. i will say at the outset that those i've been talking to were skeptical about donald trump's ability to win are saying we can win it. and they see the opening that is there. but we're not yet at the conventions. we're not -- and those are defining moments. as steve knows, you know, looking back you're on television 24/7. the mitt romney convention, i thought, it was a big hit for him. the other way. it was a negative. i mean, he came out of there kind of in a bewildered state. he didn't arouse his constituency. we remember the clint eastwood moment where he lost control of it. at the same time, it can go the other way for democrats as well this time. we'll see how hillary does if we have one of the bill clinton moments when he was nominated. you remember michael doukas went out for what seemed like two days at the time. there are a lot of big events

coming between now and then. then the next phase, we're in the fourth quarter. we've got debates and we've got get out the vote. this is a lot of stuff to happen here before we get too excited about these polls. that's what i'm saying. republican leaders are saying we can win this guy. >> because of the data that we've seen for voters who are women, voters who are african-american, voters who are latino, the conventional wisdom has been that hillary clinton is the favorite. but does anything in those numbers a that you saw today change that opinion for you? >> a little bit. the wrong track number in this country is still about 65%. hillary clinton is much more the establishment candidate. this is an electorate that is going to change fundamentally as we go along, and donald trump is the disrupter in a year where 65% of the country thinks we're on a wrong track. it's a better place to be than a person with the guilted establishment résume. >> and we've been sitting here

having the conversation about likability. i've heard from three gop pollsters who made the same point. who said people don't vote on likability. social securi it's something they talk about but they vote on change. an electorate where change is desired. trump represents the greatest change. >> he does. the debates will be a defining moment in seeing the two of them together on a stage going back and forth. and it will be interesting to see what kind of formats each think is best to bring out his her or her strengths. the people who don't want to see hillary clinton or donald trump be president of the united states are searching, perhaps, in vain for a third party candidate. john kasich says officially it's a non-starter. he's not sure he'll endorse donald trump. senator ben sasse called for an independent bid for someone but that someone will not be him. i've just obviously think the country will be having a more

meaningful conversation it's having now. >> it sounds like you're still -- >> no, i've never been open to it. it's obvious from the polling and my experience that every grocery store and gas station fill up is that people wish they had better choices. they wish we we have an optim t optimistic conversation about the country. we have the two most unpopular party front runners in the history of presidential polling. >> i don't want to get into who -- i've had a phone call with somebody who wanted me to run -- consider running me as third party. >> are you? >> no. i'm not going to do that. i think running third party doesn't feel right. i think it's not constructive. you can have depth to something and people think it's politics. no. when i talk about two paths, you know, the path of rebuilding the country or pushing people down b into the ditch, that's not a political employ that somebody calculated for me.

that's my insides that's my soul. a third party candidacy would be viewed as a silly thing. i don't think it's appropriate. >> steve schmidt, you actually ran arnold schwarzenegger's campaign in california. you talked about the rise of donald trump. you see things coming before other people do. let's talk about the third party. kasich says it's a silly idea. and yet you look at these numbers. you look at the disapproval, the unliability of these two candidates. if it doesn't happen this year, when would it happen? >> i think it's going to happen soon. look, when the two parties nominate two candidates who as unpopular as these two are, it means that the party are fraying. the fact of the fastest growing segment of the election rate is independent voters decline to state. that's the fastest growing art. >> what is that percentage

nationwide? >> i don't know off the top of my head. i know it's the fastest growing part of the american electorate. when you look inside the numbers, some polling i've seen is that essentially up to 40% of the lelectorate wish in this cae had another choice beyond the two that are there now. the parties are increasingly talking to smaller and smaller slices of the american electorate. we live in a culture where choice has whether it's on your television channels, your choice of music, is the binary choice is from an age that is passed in every other part of american life. so i do think that it's possible for independent candidate to run. we might see it in 2020. for sure i do think that the outcome of this election whatever it may be, will have an implication for that and you look four years from now. i think it would an independent candidacy. i think we came close in this

election cycle to seeing one or two. and the door is not foreclosed yet. the door is not foreclosed yet on it. and an independent candidate -- access the ballot in 48 states. >> i think the notion that you only hurt the republican is what is being falsely repeated over and over again. i actually think that someone getting in now could draw from disenchanted republicans and disenchanted democrats. this is about a rigged system and an electorate unhappy on both sides. if there's one fallacy with the conversation around this idea in this cycle, it would only hurt the republican. i think it would hurt the democrat, too. >> chuck todd -- >> i was going to say, joe, in a way we've got a third party candidate in the democratic prima primaries. bernie sanders running against hillary doing as well as he is is a kind of a third party candidate. >> absolutely. >> there's a 74-year-old socialist running against all the things she stands. she expected him to have a core nation and she's fighting for

her life trying to get to the convention as a presumptive nominee. so there is a lot of unrest out there. at the same time, lots of change. but ross perot spent a ton of money and had an appealing message for the people who were unhappy and he got 19% of the vote. >> before he dropped out he had the conspiracy. >> right. >> at one point before he dropped out, he was ahead and you have the right candidate, the right charisma, the right financing it's possible. >> yeah. and, steve, that's a great point. chuck todd, ross perot going into bill clinton's democratic convention in new york was a first place. >> right. >> he had the lead. >> then he started talking about black panthers coming in by helicopter trying to break his up daughter's weddings. i don't know if he got demotions and other various ufos but he

started talking crazy. the fact he got one out of five votes speaks volumes to what he could have done. i don't know if ross perot could have won, but i know he was in first place right in the heart of the summer right in the middle of things. i wonder if when you look into the trump numbers and the clinton numbers, how strong is their support? >> well, i think it's more of their support, their strength of their support is based on the weakness of their opponent. you know, there's core groups for each side, and they each have some core groups of supporters, but remember in many cases, a good, you know, we'll figure this out over time but 20 to 30% of trump's number is antihillary and probably have a good same amount on her side being an anti--trump. let me say something about the third party. never before has there been more of an opportunity. trump is the third party candidate. he's the disrupter.

if you're going to be an independent candidate you want to be the disrupter. trump has the message already. if you're mark cuban or somebody like that, even michael bloomberg and want to rail against both parties. donald trump has been railing against the system. i think that's the unique stumbling block this time for somebody in the middle. by the way, the best way to get on the ballot in all 50 states now. go hijack the libertarian party nomination. it's there. they haven't done their convention and they can get on all 50 states. >> all right. chuck todd, thank you very much. tom, before we let you go. you were causing trouble. >> i'm surprised joe hasn't raised it. i did commencement at ole miss. i said i'm so happy to be here because if i was were speaking to alabama i would have to use shorter words and sentences. big reaction.

it went viral in alabama. folks, it was a joke. trust me, if i were speaking in alabama i would have used florida state. it was a joke! >> all right, tom. whatever. all i know is next time you're going through the state, man, you better have tinted windows. it gets rough around montgomery. thank you, tom brokhaw. willie, do you believe the hatefulness? >> typical politician says one thing in one state and another in another. >> i've learned a few things along the way. >> typical twitter trips all the humor and elegance of the great man's words. >> tom, thank you very much. chuck, thank you. ben, stay with us. president obama calls him the secretary of explaining stuff. but what title will hillary clinton give bill clinton? and was mayhem at the nevada convention this weekend. a preview of things to come for democrats.

i think nevada democratic convention. democratic convention this weekend a fight broke out between supporters of hillary clinton and bernie sanders. you should have seen it. there were npr tote bags everywhere. it was a nightmare! sources say it was a close fight but hillary supporters were able to win by 1%. 0- as you'll see,

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when you hear someone longing for the good old days, take it with a grain of salt. the good old days weren't all that good. by almost every measure, america is better and the world is better than it was 50 years ago or 30 years ago or even 8 years ago. >> president obama saying there things looking up. is the same true for black america? up next we check on the state eight years in the administration of the first black president. marc morial joins us with his organization's new report and its impact on this election. it's next on morning joe. ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪

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findings and get you through them here. one of them full equality with white american was represented 100%. right now african-americans have just over 72% equality. broken down by categories. black americans are far less equal in terms of economic opportunity, health, educational, and social justice. mr. mayor, it's good to see you. >> good morning. >> as you look at this report this year compared to years past. what is jumping out? >> since the recession, things have gotten better in the areas of health and if we look at a 40-year retrospect from the first year in 1976 we made progress in a number of areas. the economic disparities remain stagnant and seem to be locked into the system. this is why this year's report has a big solution. the main street marshall plan. we need an investment plan to invest in the main streets of

america. we rebuilt baghdad, we bailed out the banks, put our money where our mouth is, it's time to put commitment and resources behind helping main street, which hasn't fully recovered, f. that's the main street of america's urban communities, big and small. >> you're calling for a commitment of $1 trillion in the main street marshal plan that includes early childhood education. federal living wage of $15 an hour, indexed to inflation. urban infrastructure for schools, community centers, libraries, the list goes on. how realistic is this idea as you look at where we are in our politics right now. how much money is laying around. can this actually get through? >> we need to be ambitious. i'd ask if we don't do this and we repeat yesterday's, if you will, approach, which is we point to the problem. we identify the problem. then we don't do anything about it. so, willie, i think we're at an inflection point in this

country. many americans have come back after the recession, but too many americans are left behind. if you look at these unemployment figures in black chicago, black cleveland, many of these communities, they are 20%-plus. these are depression-era unemployment levels. what goes along with that is violence, police community tensions. we have no choice. we have got to take a strong step to try to address these problems. and what we've done as the urban league has said we're not just going to be diagnostic. we're going to come up with an idea, a plan and say to those that want to lead this country, not only the next president, but governors, mayors, members of the united states senate, take a look at our plan. where do you stand? if you don't like our plan, where is your plan? >> mr. mayor, what right now? because we always love having you come once a year -- come a

lot more than once a year but at least give us an update once a year on where you are. what's the big idea this year? if you can take one part of this report and educate americans on what they nid to know, what would that be? >> what americans need to know is even when you improve education, which is critical, you still have economic disparities. so the urban infrastructure plan, joe, which would invest -- public and private investment in urban communities, i think is a big idea. it's an image native idea. what what we did to stabilize the banks. look what we're doing to rebuild baghd baghdad. the resources and ingenuity we've put into this. main street america has not fully recovered in the aftermath of the recession. so let us address this longst d

longstanding problem. >> listening to mark morial and joe talk about the main street marshall plan. it is amazing. it would be amazing to many americans to go to urban areas. mark mentioned chicago, boston, new york, and find the number of block upon block upon block in black portions of the city where there are no bank branches and no supermarkets. >> and it's been that way for decades. baltimore is another city you can go block after block after block and find nothing. boarded up houses, abandoned houses. for the state of black america, i wonder, given what the mayor was just talking about, where is speaker ryan? where does he fit in this conversation because here's someone who is a leader of the house of representatives, leading republican in the government who talks about poverty. who talks about income inequality. i wonder what he would make of this urban marshall plan and a

trillion dollars over five years. what does he think about that? >> some of these ideas in the marshall plan, early childhood education and 15 bucks an hour being tried in cities around the country. laboratories and hopefully the results lead to good things. mark morial, thanks. the annual state of black america report is out today. go online and check it out. we'll be back in a moment.

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still ahead, we'll set the stage for today's primaries in

kentucky n oregon. and new national polling shows hillary clinton's lead over donald trump has just about evaporate 37d. plus, trump says it's important to be unpredictable. this morning he's telegraphing how he'll go after the former secretary of state in the general election. we'll have that plan of attack. and jonathan capehart tonight on "jeopardy." how do you do? >> can't tell you. i'd have to kill you. >> we'll have to watch. when a moment turns romantic why pause to take a pill? or stop to find a bathroom? cialis for daily use is approved to treat

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get this. ben carson suggested donald trump is considering sarah palin as his running mate. america was like, hey, if we're going to do this, we might as well do this, right?

>> welcome back to "morning joe." tuesday, may 17th. joe is up in boston. why was he there? because he and mika last night inducted into the cable hall of fame. joe, congrats. >> it was a great honor. a wonderful time there to be celebrated along with pioneers in the industry. this cable industry that really has redefined a media landscape, and the people that were honored other than us, people that took great risks throughout their entire lives to build, again, this new media landscape. when they started, everybody thought they were crazy. but, of course, we thanked you and everybody else associated with the show that made it possible. a little uncomfortable at one moment, but mika actually, she thanked her family, she thanked the bord and then dedicated it to the memory of vladimir lennon. i'm thinking, what are you doing? >> why would you do something like that?

>> don't do something like that. don't put your politics on your sleeve. we were tearing up. they also celebrated -- i think it was marx. also they celebrated tom rogers, one of these guys that believed in cable before others believed in cable. fought to get nbc on cable. did it first with cnbc and then msnbc. i'm sure he's sorry about that second idea. it seemed like such a good idea at the time. it was a great night, and it was a great honor for all of us. >> he's a great pioneer. when baseball players go in, they wonder what team they'll go into the hall of fame with. were you going to go in with "morning joe" or "scarborough country." >> you came on with the "morning joe" hat and put it on.

congrats again. we've got with uformer communications director for george w. bush nicolle wallace, mark halperin, and ben ginsberg. hillary clinton at 48%, donald trump at 45%. tightening from last week. secretary clinton maintains her advantage over trump with women voters. a 15-point spread there. 19 last week. trump's 11-point lead among men remaining unchanged. clinton wins black voters, . trump doing better among independents. 44% to clinton's 36%. more republicans actually trust donald trump to lead the republican party over paul ryan. that figure is 58% to 39% for

the speaker, joe. >> yeah, the numbers, there are a lot of numbers that jump out at us. mark halperin, let's talk about that number in front of us. donald trump at 58%. paul ryan, 39%. who better represents the republican party? that shows the sea change that washington establishment republicans haven't gotten. they didn't get this year. they haven't gotten for many years. but now it's really just sort of blown up in their face. this is not their party anymore. this is not the party of the k street republicans. it's not the party of tom delay. it's not the party of john boehner. this is a party of donald trump. >> and there's been insufficient soul searching within that wing of the party to say, why did this happen? is this because trump has been a great candidate or is it because a lot of the party, a lot of the country does not want the party defined as being close to wall street, close to big business and for economic policies that's don't seem to a lot of working

families to be benefiting them. whether trump wins or loses, that's wing of the party will have to decide whether it needs to rethink whether the things it's for are in step with where the party is today. >> and the numbers are so close. right now you have trump just -- he's within the margin of error. nobody would have seen this coming weeks ago. in fact, all of the press was talking about how hillary clinton was up by 10, 15, 20 points, and it may take him all summer to tighten this up. we're basically in a virtual tie in plmay. >> last week we were talking about the battleground states. inched ahead of hillary clinton in ohio and florida. that's where the war will be waged. even with these national poll numbers out, there's still very little pressure on bernie sanders to get out of a race where he's clearly damaging hillary clinton with his ongoing onslaught on her credibility and character and qualifications. and i think now we talked about

swing voters being influenced when they hear the same message from a democrat they hear from a republican. these poll numbers reflect it's not just the democratic primary opponent attacking hillary clinton but an attack coming from both sides of the ideological spectrum. real damage is being done to her, and the damage will only sort of reveal itself when we see how she stands in november up to donald trump who is being fortified by this. donald trump is being fortified by the process of traveling to washington and having proud members of the #nevertrump movement endorse him publicly. basically reverse themselves. these are people who have repudiated him as a primary candidate. they're embracing him at a time bernie sanders is still assaulting hillary clinton's character. >> it is unbelievable. ben ginsberg, so many thought it would be the republican party fighting the ugly primary for a long time. it's actually the democrats now. but, of course, the republican party is still -- some

republican establishment members still trying to figure out how to get behind donald trump. for the most part would you say it's a guy that's been around washington, d.c., republicans for many, many years that they have surrendered. we have had our missouri moment on the deck of the "missouri" and it's been an unconditional surrender for the most part to donald trump. >> yeah, there's still a few soldiers fighting on deserted islands who may not realize it. but certainly poll numbers like this will lead to an additional coalescing of the party. >> anybody excited as this republican party excited about getting behind trump, or is this just what they feel like they have to do? we must support the republican nominee no matter who it is? >> with this election, what it's about and significant for the democrats and republicans is it's not clear who either the republican or the democratic party is. this is the election cycle when the core functions, the political parties usually do,

raising money, mobilizing voters, messaging on tv. it's being taken over by outside groups. it's not the core party function at all which is why the labels are getting so diluted. >> joe, there are a fair number of republicans, fair number of conservatives. a lot of people you and i both know, not only online and in media but up on capitol hill who say i can't get behind donald trump for principled reasons. what do they do? there's talk of a third party candidate. what happens to that group of people who say i can't do it? >> i've talked to a lot of them that have just said they're not going to vote, or they're going to vote for a third party candidate. you say when you don't vote for the republican nominee, you're in effect helping hillary clinton get elected, and that's just a risk many of them are willing to take. you also have some gop donors that talk about giving money to hillary clinton as well. i think that will be on the margins. i think for the most part the

greatest danger is what we've seen when romney ran in '12, when john mccain ran in 2008. conservatives not excited to go out, not excited to knock on doors. not excited to pick up the phone and do all the sort of phone banks. i'm talking about the traditional gop republicans that have run primaries and have usually been the foot soldiers in the general election campaigns. they just stay at home. nicolle, you know better than anybody else, george w. bush won for one reason. well, he won for many reasons, but logistics had so much to do about it. ken mehlman in 2004 would call a regional chairwoman and chairmen and say this is how many people i need on your team by our call in two weeks. and if they didn't have those numbers, thank you so much for your service, and just fire

people. and would find somebody else to pick it up. and ken mehlman created a ground army, district by district, state by state all across the nation. at the end of the day, that's was the difference for george w. bush in 2004. a lot of those people in 2016, unless they don't get excited about donald trump are just going to stay home. >> yeah, but the obama's team's own admission they became students of what mehlman and others created. ken mehlman's favorite word was metrics, measured. during the course of his campaigns he hasn't lost faith with the base of his party and was deeply connected to the issues driving independent voters. he was able to narrow the gender gap. married women chose him in enough numbers over john kerry. george w. bush understood

exactly what he needed to do. he never sort of lost his touch on the rope line. he never stopped understanding what it was at the base of the party wanted or needed. we've talked about 2008. it was sarah pailin who had her finger more closely on the pulse of where the republican base was heading. they were disenfranchised and angry. sarah palin had a better feel for that dynamic than even our own candidate at the top of the ticket. so i think everything has changed and nothing has changed. the base of the republican party has been screaming at the top of their lungs for 16 years and they've finally been heard. >> to your point about who may or may not stay home in the fall, these poll numbers we're going over today, it's, what, may 17th? so it's a snapshot of a particular moment in time, very early in this whole thing.

but there's a culmination of volatility, forecasterati volatility, frustration and disappointment out there that's not measured by any poll i've seen yet and leads into what you just read. how many stayed home out of sheer disappointment that these are the choices offered. >> and i wonder, you look at the choices being offered, and we talked about this before, willie. you talk about the approval ratings and disapproval ratings. you can take a poll that you can say, would you like a 1973 impala or 1979 vega hatchback? if those are your two choices, i'd go with the vega hatchback. it's incredible what you can dump in the back. it's unbelievable. but anyway, i got distracted for a second talking about my first car. >> you're talking about the favorability ratings. >> you give people two choices. they've got to pick a side.

i wonder what people would do if they were given a third choice here. this is what john meachum has been talking about for five years, six years on the show. 150-year duopoly that's dominated american democracy in a way that no two other parties have ever dominated any government system. and i just wonder, at what point is that broken up so people have more than two choices? they have more of a choice than going to a parking lot and saying, you can get this impala or get this vega. it's insanity the way we elect our presidents in this country. >> joe, again, to that point, and incidentally, i'd take the vega. to that point, look at the average american. what the average american bumps into each and every day, whether you go to a restaurant, whether you have 500 items on the menu. you have cable channels, 200 to choose from. you want music? go to spotify.

you can pick your own thing. you get hundreds of thousands of songs to choose from. amazon movies and documentaries. hundreds. elections? two people. >> but the answer to joe's question is, yes. i think they would choose curtain number three. at this moment in time, i don't think it matters what's behind the curtain. i'll take the surprise offer. >> 22 choices. the american people had 22 choices. >> that was in the primary. now the primaries are over. if there were another option on the menu, a lot of people would be intrigued. >> we'veays come down to two. >> that's the past. >> the point is, is this the breakout year where curtain number three -- >> the final three choices, two of them weren't members of their party two years ago. so seems to me that's a lot of diversity of options. >> well, mark halperin with all due respect, you sound like some old guy in a commercial that says, well, there's never been a

phone where you can listen to music on it before. nobody will buy that. well, yes, we've always come down to two. we've always done a lot of things. this is something i've said for ages. you look at every sector in the american economy. there has been a revolution in every single sector except for politics and education. >> we've had a revolution. we got a socialist who hasn't had a single fund-raiser this entire campaign and a billionaire who hasn't had a single fund-raiser. they've had one or two, but you know what i'm saying. a guy who rose on the back of social media. i'd say two of the last three candidates are absolutely creatures of the new age in which we're living and represent a fundamental revolution in our political process. >> and we have two choices left. one that has a 37% approval rating and one that has a 40% approval rating. and the question is, why isn't

there another choice? why aren't there three other choices? what is it about our system that makes sure, ben ginsberg, woe'v got a system that's rigged. we're going to run a process where you are going to select your two primary finalists. and by the time we know who the two people are that are going to run as republicans and democrats, it's too late to get on any ballots as an independent. >> yeah, that's really true. >> you talk about a rigged system. rigged for a two-party system. that is the biggest sham of all. >> the truth is this is a country that gives its authority over these sorts of elections to each state. and each of the states has a very sort of coloquial way of letting them keep control. if you were a third party you have to go through the pain and

agony the libertarians and greens and even americans elect in 2012 went through. it's a system designed to make it difficult for a third party candidate to get on a presidential ballot. >> last thing i'd say before we get to kristen welker covering hillary clinton is, the moment is here. somebody has to step in to the void. >> give us a prius. >> ben sass says he's not going to do it. y john kasich doesn't want to do it. mitt romney won't do it. somebody has to step up and do it. >> yeah. >> let's go to brooklyn now. >> i'm surprised ben sass. ben sass was writing facebook posts and talking about it. i'm surprised he just dismissed it outright. >> maybe somebody will do it. coming in now from brooklyn, nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker. she's been covering the clinton campaign. two primaries today. the former secretary of state has been fighting on a couple of fronts, donald trump and bernie sanders. she's got a handful, doesn't

she, kristen? we heard from donald trump yesterday in "the new york times" talking about how highs going to approach her, bringing in the personal life of her husband. in the meantime, bernie sanders just keeps winning primaries. >> that's right. you are absolutely right, willie. she's got a handful. that's a great way to describe it. she's fighting this battle on two fronts and has been for some time. first to donald trump. i spoke with a clinton campaign official just moments ago who reiterated she is not going to respond to his personal attacks. she's not going to respond when he takes on bill clinton's past infidelities. she's trying to paint donald trump as a candidate who is untested and dangerous for the country. we've heard that in her stump speeches. she's been going after him for his tax plans, for example. but what's interesting is she's also trying to shift the narrative on her husband. in recent days saying that she's going to put him in charge of revitalizing the economy when you dig into that a little bit deeper. officials say that really means he's going to be targeting communities that need help and

need their -- to their economy's revitalized. but what's significant about it is that it underscores she's making a choice to really focus on what they see as bill clinton's strength which is the economy. if you talk to some democrats, that strategy does come with some risks because essentially this is an election cycle that seems to favor outsiders. by doing that, they're just reminding voters they are no strangers to washington and to the white house. so the question is, is that going to be an effective strategy moving forward? and then to the primary, she has been campaigning aggressively in kentucky. kentucky and oregon vote today. she really wants a win in kentucky to try to turn the narrative and start winning some of these primaries so she heads into the convention on solid ground. >> kristen welker in brookbrook thank you. how campaigns and presidencies are made and broken by how candidates react.

first, bill karins has a look at the forecast. >> it's middle of may. tornado season. we expect bad weather. we're going to get some today. yesterday the texas, north texas and oklahoma panhandle region. a couple reports of tornadoes. about seven of them. this was annu elephant trunk tornado. they didn't do any damage. today, only isolated tornados. also significant winds yesterday. this will be the problem today. if we get damage today it will be from large hail and wind damage. dallas, texas, ft. worth. storms all morning, they dissipated. you're dry, good to go. they'll push toward san angelo and austin and san antonio later this evening like 8:00 to 9:00 p.m. target area for large hail, baseball sized hail and then storms close to the texas coast with possibility of wind damage. the other story out there will be the rain that's going to continue. right now it's raining from areas all north of the gulf,

atlanta, right up through the appalachians and into washington, d.c. this is going to be with us throughout much of the day. minor airport delays possible with this. it's been so gloomy in the mid-atlantic. inn fortuna unfortunately, another storm for the weekend. especially saturday night in the mid-atlantic. rainy may. cool day continues. figures. we had a beautiful march and april. and now this has been mother nature's payback. we're leaving you with a shot -- oh, portland, oregon, at sunrise. they've had one of the best springs ever. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. covering is caring because covering heals faster. for a bandage that moves with you and stays on all day, cover with a band-aid brand flexible fabric adhesive bandage. with usaa is awesome. homeowners insurance life insurance automobile insurance i spent 20 years active duty they still refer to me as "gunnery sergeant" when i call

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right now, who are you consult with consistently so that you're ready on day one? >> i'm speak with myself, number one, because i have a very good brain. >> up next, we'll go inside the mind of donald trump. the atlantic magazine's latest cover story is by a psychologist who analyzes the man who could become the next president of the united states. we'll be right back.

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you just cross this? you have to go where the code is. >> this thing here. >> that was back in 1992, and it was president george h.w. bush's encounter with a supermarket scanner that's made front page news in "the new york times." flash forward to 2016 and it's donald trump's relationship with women that's generating the headlines. our next guest says in both cases it comes down to a narrative and whether the candidate capitalized or conc e concedes to the story. former advance man to bill clinton, josh king author of "off script," an advanced man's guide to white house stagecraft, campaign spectacle and campaign suicide. it's amazing to go back and look at that 1992. those things were fairly new but it dominated the coverage of the campaign for a while. >> i was watching the

conversation happening around this table yesterday about how they talked to all of these potential witnesses for the front page "new york times" story but only honed into one and the one where the person afterwards said it didn't happen that way. if we think of the last 30 years since george h.w. bush went to the national grocers association to make a speech after his state of the union address, he's always been labeled as out of touch because he didn't know what a supermarket scanner was. he was just on his way to a speech. the advanced guys wanted him to see an exhibit of basey the cow. he said let's go over there to that supermarket scanner. bob graham from national cash register was there. and bush always the polite gentleman. wanted to be a dutifull visitor sort of as you saw looked

interestingly at it and did what all visitors do. and greg mcdonald was the single print pooler. this is how these start. the only print reporter watching this because it was a tight confined space writes a little pool report and says president had look of wonder on face. brings that back to the filing center. it's mimiographed and passed around and andrew rosenthal is trying to right the story for "the new york times." he writes it up and the headline writer comes up with bush encounters supermarket, amazed. he wrote a few paragraphs at the top of it which use the narrative of him sort of gazing at the supermarket scanner to make it reflect on his whole life as being out of touch when we know that's not true. >> that would seem to be a really easy thing to combat. the president of the united states. nobody expects him to be in aisle three of the grocery store. how could they not combat that successfully? >> well, because it's hard when

the editors of "the times" decide this is front page material as the story was yesterday. this is the story we want to tell. president out of touch. and we've got a picture of it. >> let me broaden this out to a story that doesn't assail my favorite president of all times and you can see this is john kerry on a windsurfing device. i don't even know what you call it. i worked on a campaign where we found this video in the heat of the 2004 election and our central attack was that he flip flopped. he voted for military funding before he voted against it. mark mckinnon, brilliant ad maker. he took this video of him wind surfing and put it to music. and so it is always the case, not the exception, it is the rule that when you find an incident that furthers the narrative, either negative or

positive about a candidate, you feel like you've won the lottery. donald trump seemed to combat this story yesterday and the tools of social media seem to make it easier for candidates to combat and dismantle the narrative. >> february 4th, 1992, when "the times" comes out with a front page paper, who are we to object? how are we to protest? you have even the subjects of the article coming out and saying that's not what i was trying to convey about mr. trump when they interviewed me. they told me it was going to be something different. and now if she can protest about that once it can be retweeted a million times. you have a constant echo chamber and check process against what journalism is these days, which has both good and bad elements. in this case, i think trump had his army coming right to bat for him to say that you can't do it like 1992 anymore. you can't just put that picture on the front page of "the times"

with enough copy around it to create a narrative and it's going to stick. it's going to be batted down pretty fast. that's why so many of these pictures and fumbles throughout the campaign have not lasted very long. it's replaced by something else. 15 hours later. >> so donald trump has paul manafort, a few others who worked with him occasionally. he responds to these things by himself. hillary clinton has 70 communications staffers and surrogates out there on her behalf. who has a more effective army? >> it's not even close. donald trump has rendered the jobs i had in washington politics irrelevant and useless and meaningless. and if he went to the white house, i don't think he'd have the size -- maybe he will because you have to deal with communications, roll-outs and planning. donald trump has rendered totally meaningless and irrelevant jobs like i had on campaigns. >> should hillary clinton hire more communications folks? >> i think they need to adapt to

the asymmetrical wars they'll have with donald trump. every morning be ready to respond to his twitter feed. i was thinking about this "new york times" story last night. how would i deal with this? donald trump never goes on defense. he lives on offense. there is nothing that happens to donald trump, no piece of -- there was a phone message of his voice pretending to be him or himself as -- i read it seven times and my brain couldn't process. he wasn't on defense for a second because he denied it. he lives on offense. >> let's try to find out why. >> i'd love to get it. let's bottle it and sell it. >> let's bring in psycologis ps dan adams. he writes the atlantic cover "the mind of donald trump." dan, who did not speak to the candidate for the piece, used trump's own books, speeches and interviews for his reporting.

so, dan, off of what you just heard, and us talking about donald trump, always on offense, what's kind of a president do you think -- what would you be looking at in the trump administration? >> you are looking at a guy who scores really high on two really basic traits about human nature. one is he's off the map on the social dominance dimension. a high action, high energy person, maybe more than any prth we've seen and more than any other candidates. on the other end this rock bottom score or rating on the dimension of agreeableness which gets that warmth and caring and how he has this actually shocking inability to, or nondesire to express empathy. and so what you're looking at here is a very bold, always on the offense decisionmaker who is not afraid to take big risks to create the shiniest and biggest

possible impact. but without a whole lot of concern about the collateral damage that might ensue. >> what does his recent -- i think it was a couple of days ago, back and forth about david camer cameron, prime minister of great britain and trump. trump being told that cameron said that he thought his language was inappropriate, that it was kind of stupid the things he said about muslim bans. what does that say about his -- trump's sense of aggression when it comes to the world stage and other world leaders? should we be worried about that? >> his aggressiveness is pretty amazing. he talks about it in his books. suggested he's had the same temperament since like second grade. i think there is something to that. in second grade he punched out his music teacher. hit the guy in the eye because he didn't think the guy knew anything about music. that's second grade, right? but there's something still there. he's coming up on 70 years of age here, and he is a hard-charging, aggressive guy with respect to the temperament.

anger is behind a lot of this, and it works to his advantage. he is able to go on the offense all the time. he is able to sort of take center stage, and it doesn't seem to be the case that objections to his being crude and intemperate have much of an effect. i have to get your phone number because i feel i could call you every day. the day he locked up the gop nomination, he spent the day accusing ted cruz, his father was a participant to the assassination of president kennedy. at night, i think it was maybe 12 hours later, when he had dropped out of the race he said, i don't know if he likes me or not. what is it about his sense of the potential for reconciliation that's unique because that is the most extraordinary piece about trump's candidacy. >> i have to say, i was annoyed when those came out because those were great examples which i could have used in the article. >> we've got to get your number.

you can weigh in every day. >> the reconciliation is interesting. i'm not sure trump holds grudges. he gets out there and he fights. he tries to win. he wins a lot of times. doesn't always win. then afterwards, it's not like he kisses and makes up but he's typically willing to let bygones be bygones and move forward. he's vanquished all his opponents in the republican primary as we know and yet he's going to have to pick somebody to be a running mate down the road and find allies and so on. it will be interesting to see his ability to do that. i really don't know how that's going to play out. he's managed to succeed in these ways in the business world but i think politics has a really very different dynamic. >> let's make you guess about the fall campaign. you base this article on what you've seen. nicole described the primary as it's been so far. how do you think as more of the -- can people see this guy

in the oval office? how does that affect his demeanor and what he says and how he acts? >> i don't think his demeanor is going to change. he's going to stay on the aggressive road, but i do think the scrutiny is going to change. as people begin to imagine what it will be like to have donald trump in the oval office. i think they may start getting beyond his temperament, beyond this extro version and disagreeableness and what's behind this? what are his motivations and goals? what are his values? what's his story? and i spend a lot of time in the piece wondering about, if you get behind the mask of the warrior here, what kind of narrative is he living out, and how would that be used in his administration? and i think what you end up coming out with, it's not very inspiring. if you look at what his life goal has been, and you can go back to like high school for this, his life goal has always been to be number one. it's not to make the most money necessarily. he says i like money but mainly because it tells me what my

score is, how i'm doing. he wants to be number one. okay. let's say he does win the election and, okay, now he's won. and now what? and i sense his story for his life is all about winning. once he wins the big contest, he is sitting in the white house on day one. now what? i think most presidents then can look to their own values and goals, their belief systems, philosophies. trump, it's all about being number one. there isn't really a narrative there to guide him as president. >> potentially it's like the end of the movie "the candidate." what do we do now? the new issue of "the atlantic" is out now. dan mcadams, thanks. still ahead -- carl icahn announced last month he was dumping his apple stock. now the company is getting a vote of confidence from a different billionaire. "morning joe" will be right back. you both have a

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well, i know what time it is. it's time for business before the bell with sara eisen over at cnbc. and sara, you going to give us a little warren buffett deal here today? what is he up to? >> berkshire hathaway taking a billion-dollar bite out of apple. a battle of the tightans over apple stock. big boost and vote of confidence from berkshire. it's not really a buffett-style investment. warren buffett likes old school industries like insurance and railroad. it does own ibm, food companies, and that's because this isn't a trade made by warren buffett. it's made by one of his lieutenants. they have two former hedge fund managers managing the massive stock portfolio of berkshire. so this big bet does show there's a transition when it comes to warren buffett's berkshire hathaway as the billionaire turns 86. it also comes up an interesting point for apple where carl icahn

told us he is out of apple stock because he's worried about chinese sales. and the stock has been trading at the lowest point since 2014 after they saw sales decline for the first time in almost a decade. there are questions about whether it can grow again. that news sent apple to the top of the dow and helped fuel a big rally for the stock market. we'll see if we can extend it today. one bright spot could be home dep depot. americans are spending on home improvement. a great quarter which stands in contrast to other retailers like department stores which are not seeing rising sales. back to you. >> sara, i'm sorry you threw it back to me because i wanted to show my expertise in the market and ask you about oil. up next, we'll take a quick road trip across two of the states that may just pick the next president. keep it right here. is about vision and integrity,

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two of the state's keys to winning the white house -- ohio and pennsylvania. more than 500 miles of interstate 80 runs through those swing states and few have a better feel for the area's politics than the truck drivers who traverse that span every day. joining us now from columbus, ohio, msnbc correspondent, jacob soboroff. what are voters telling you? >> good morning. you said it. these highways may hold the key

to who the next president of the united states is. i was watching you guys earlier. amazing to hear about priorities usa action, hillary clinton superpac spending $1.75 million in this state before the democrats have even locked up their nomination. i was on straight 80 that runs between ohio and pennsylvania. two swing states. i went to the swingiest part of one of the swingiest states in the union. i'm at the truck world truck stop in hubbard, ohio. very few roads are as important to the 2016 presidential election because it runs through the swing states of ohio and pennsylvania. and nobody knows this area better than these truckers. have you thought about who you're going to vote for? >> i don't know. i don't trust either one of them. >> that's donald trump and hillary clinton? >> yes. >> is it possible for hillary clinton to whin over your vote? >> yes. >> ritired salesman.

what are you doing here at truck world. >> have to eat something. >> what do you think is going to happen? figured out which way you're going to go? >> i think trump is the lesser of two evils. >> chuck, i want to look at this map. what does the next president need to do to win over the voters of the i-80 corridor through ohio? >> he's got to convince the voters he's going to bring back industry that went overseas and to mexico. trump is a good man to do that. >> or she? >> not she. no, no. >> where are you from? >> kentucky. >> are you a truck driver? >> yes. >> what kind of truck? >> kenworth. >> 16-wheeler? >> 18-wheeler. i don't know anything about trucks. >> who are you going for in november? >> trump. >> so where you come from, kentucky is most likely going to go for trump. but this i-80 corridor can pretty much decide it. which way do you think they'll go up here? >> i believe they'll go for

trump. i do. i believe it's going to really surprise a lot of people. >> can we check out your truck? >> yeah, sure can. >> what is it about, you know, what's going on here on this i-80 corridor that's going -- that people go for him over hillary clinton? >> to me, it all boils down to jobs. i have made a lot of money in ohio in my 28, 29 years of trucking. there's a lot of places, you know, that are no more. these factories, a lot of them have just closed up and left. >> when you pull the air horn, where is that? >> right here. >> can you do it? >> yeah, help yourself. thank you, sir. one of the folks, nicolle that i got to spend some time with was a democrat his entire life. he told me his folks were democrats, union people but he h was going to be over to vote for donald trump.

if you have never done it before, pull that horn, it's a blast. >> i love your reports. i feel like i learn something from all of them. >> jacob soboroff. >> thank you so much. that was awesome. so final thoughts. josh, where do you think this is going from here? you think hillary clinton? you mumbled hillary could learn something. >> she took the scooby van from chappaqua by her visit to the chipolte. she would get into an 18-wheeler for a few stops and not bring the cameras and have conversations with these people and report back on that. conventions, vp pick, debate, all the usual stuff is how we need to comport yourself. >> someone close to her already has? i think we have a picture of -- see her husband is reading it. >> there's the book of the month club selection arrived in chappaqua. >> that's not bad.

>> very pleased about having the president see all the work that the advance people did for him all those years. >> authenticity is key. it's the new specificity. >> ben? >> i miss my reporting days. i want to be able to ride in trucks like jacob and blow air horns. >> nicole? >> i'm just going to go road this because this is a message for the whole campaign taking place off script. >> congratulations to joe and mika for their induction last night into the cable hall of fame. and everyone will be back here on set tomorrow morning. steve kornacki picks up the coverage right now. well, we'll have a quick broadcast firbreak first and then steve. see you tomorrow. real is making new friends. amazing is getting this close. real is an animal rescue. amazing is over twenty-seven thousand of them.

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good morning. i'm steve kornacki. topping the agenda, meetings with the old guard, new hours a. a general election fund-raising plan. they all point to one thing. donald trump getting an organization ready for the general election. >> these people pay hundreds of thousands of dollars, millions of dollars to pollsters. i pay nothing. but the networks give me polls every day. >> after vowing never to use pollsters during the primary, trump changing courses this morning bringing a new pollster aboard. also, word of a meet with trump and henry kissinger as he looks to bridge the republican divide. also, hillary clinton saying her husband would handle the economy if she's prid